Totally agree just rolling back the clock. Thanks for your insight. Also there is the ‘slot’ for world champs question. Some already have the time but still have to rock up to race- Texas. Didn’t know this until I listened to a recent podcast( by accident) as too many around.
What I find interesting is the paradox in the slots for AG’ers being proportional as the most “fair” while the slots for pros being equal as the most “fair.” Like if the argument is that because there are fewer women racing in the AG field in a given race then they should get fewer slots, then wouldn’t that carry over to the pro race that has the same dynamic? (And I’m not saying this should happen, I’m definitely very glad that IM did not also go backwards for the pro women!) and certainly the positive reaction we’ve seen from a lot of pro women might have been different if we did go backwards on that too. But no one seems to be talking about this difference in pro vs amateur female qualifying at all.
I think, on some level, they understand the need for equality and what it offers. But aren't willing to bear the burden of having to explain it to angry age-group men.
Even if Race Ranger is limited to the Pros & Top 10% of AG Elites (based on qualification times), historically the top AG men routinely mix in with the Pro Women’s field. Even if RR can differentiate between categories (future upgrade as reported in Slowtwitch), I wonder if the eventual mix of BOP Pro males, FOP Pro Women, and FOP AGers could create spacing log jams which potentially could limit the ability of “weak” swim/strong bike Pro women to be able to make passes that won’t either cause them to go way over their limits making the (multiple bikes) passes, or get penalties because they get “trapped” mid-pass. The instantaneous reporting and historical reviews RR enables (good things!) may influence decision making in the field (in not such good ways) currently not anticipated, is my thought.
I would rather race Challenge Roth than Kona again. Roth was my redemption after a bad Kona. It was a better overall experience and half the price, even though I had to travel further for it!
Thank you for your views, your advocacy and your wisdom. I'm hugely disappointed with the news and I think you're right that the squeaky wheels will be the loudest with this news.
I raced Kona in 2023 and it was EPIC. It was a week long celebration of women. The pros admitted that beforehand they were sceptical but afterwards they were converted. They loved it. And didn't want to go back.
Those same pros are now gushing about the decision. All the piece to camera insta posts feel soooo contrived and almost scripted.
I also think Ironman, as an American company, just doesn't understand the impact of only hosting the WCs in the US, and Hawaii specifically. It's prohibitively expensive to get there (if you're not in the states). It's ridiculously expensive to stay there. It's stupidly expensive to buy things. The exchange rate fluctuations don't affect Americans, but the rest of the world is impacted. I paid for my Kona race entry in 2021 when it was NZD 1400. With the increased price and exchange rate, in 2024 that same race would cost me NZD 2500. How is that fair and equitable? Regardless of gender?
Kelly, I'd really love to see a discussion of a women only triathlon race brand. Why are we even arguing with white men about this disparity again. I'm an executive in higher ed but would love to be a part of something for and by women in triathlon. I grew up in San Jose, CA in the 80's as a lifeguard for the Danskin races. We need our own org and I would love to help build it. I know women from all over this country who would join the cause. Maybe fiesty should hold a zoom call and see who shows up? Ironman needs our dollars and spending power. Let's hit them in the bank account and boycott 2026. Amateurs can do that, I know the pros cannot as it is their livelihood.
Greetings from the Big Island. have been coming here for 25 years. I am here talking to locals and they are interested in an all womens race of another sort as well. Can Feisty put together a zoom so we can talk it out as women? No one on this Island likes the white male dominated Ironman situation. They are not kind to the locals. The women are!
I am so angered by this. I have the original 50 to Kona pin from that movement. Here I thought women were finally being taken seriously then the white male patriarchy says no, women, we don't want you in our sport. I live in LA. Do you know the male to female cyclist ratio? 90/10. Where are the women riding? At home on trainers because these men play chicken on roads throughout LA. Do you know how many times I have had to swerve not to be hit? EVERY RIDE FOR MORE THAN A DECADE. Kelly, this piece is the most important you have written. The white male echo chamber of ironman is real. White male fragility is also real.
“That’s not the job of a CEO, to implement poll results. If that’s all you want to do, then you certainly don’t need to pay an executive. Just hire a junior account manager to send out some SurveyMonkeys and be done with it.”
I will never give them my money again. I am headed to Kona for vacation on Saturday as I do every year. I will ride the queen k and swim with the fish for free. Also, i can run as i chose and it will cost zero dollars. Women need to start our own competing triathlong organization. I will give money to the start up. I am still mad about what Ironman did to Beth McKenzie (Gerdes). Thankfully she is living her best life and killing it with WYN. Man I am fired up in LA today!
Totally agree just rolling back the clock. Thanks for your insight. Also there is the ‘slot’ for world champs question. Some already have the time but still have to rock up to race- Texas. Didn’t know this until I listened to a recent podcast( by accident) as too many around.
What I find interesting is the paradox in the slots for AG’ers being proportional as the most “fair” while the slots for pros being equal as the most “fair.” Like if the argument is that because there are fewer women racing in the AG field in a given race then they should get fewer slots, then wouldn’t that carry over to the pro race that has the same dynamic? (And I’m not saying this should happen, I’m definitely very glad that IM did not also go backwards for the pro women!) and certainly the positive reaction we’ve seen from a lot of pro women might have been different if we did go backwards on that too. But no one seems to be talking about this difference in pro vs amateur female qualifying at all.
I think, on some level, they understand the need for equality and what it offers. But aren't willing to bear the burden of having to explain it to angry age-group men.
I’m legitimately wondering about the impact upon the Pro Women on a One Day, All Genders, Race Ranger ruled championship race. 🤔
Oh I don't think Race Ranger can manage 3,000 people yet
Even if Race Ranger is limited to the Pros & Top 10% of AG Elites (based on qualification times), historically the top AG men routinely mix in with the Pro Women’s field. Even if RR can differentiate between categories (future upgrade as reported in Slowtwitch), I wonder if the eventual mix of BOP Pro males, FOP Pro Women, and FOP AGers could create spacing log jams which potentially could limit the ability of “weak” swim/strong bike Pro women to be able to make passes that won’t either cause them to go way over their limits making the (multiple bikes) passes, or get penalties because they get “trapped” mid-pass. The instantaneous reporting and historical reviews RR enables (good things!) may influence decision making in the field (in not such good ways) currently not anticipated, is my thought.
I would rather race Challenge Roth than Kona again. Roth was my redemption after a bad Kona. It was a better overall experience and half the price, even though I had to travel further for it!
Thank you for your views, your advocacy and your wisdom. I'm hugely disappointed with the news and I think you're right that the squeaky wheels will be the loudest with this news.
I raced Kona in 2023 and it was EPIC. It was a week long celebration of women. The pros admitted that beforehand they were sceptical but afterwards they were converted. They loved it. And didn't want to go back.
Those same pros are now gushing about the decision. All the piece to camera insta posts feel soooo contrived and almost scripted.
I also think Ironman, as an American company, just doesn't understand the impact of only hosting the WCs in the US, and Hawaii specifically. It's prohibitively expensive to get there (if you're not in the states). It's ridiculously expensive to stay there. It's stupidly expensive to buy things. The exchange rate fluctuations don't affect Americans, but the rest of the world is impacted. I paid for my Kona race entry in 2021 when it was NZD 1400. With the increased price and exchange rate, in 2024 that same race would cost me NZD 2500. How is that fair and equitable? Regardless of gender?
I think, in defense of a lot of the pro women, the details were somewhat buried in the press release.
And, yeah, an interesting point I don't know how has been fully considered is how travel to the U.S. is going to be affected over the next year.
Kelly, I'd really love to see a discussion of a women only triathlon race brand. Why are we even arguing with white men about this disparity again. I'm an executive in higher ed but would love to be a part of something for and by women in triathlon. I grew up in San Jose, CA in the 80's as a lifeguard for the Danskin races. We need our own org and I would love to help build it. I know women from all over this country who would join the cause. Maybe fiesty should hold a zoom call and see who shows up? Ironman needs our dollars and spending power. Let's hit them in the bank account and boycott 2026. Amateurs can do that, I know the pros cannot as it is their livelihood.
Hah, I think you learned that the Danskin races got bought by Ironman eventually and turned into IronGirl.
But, re-inventing women's races would be an interesting idea
Greetings from the Big Island. have been coming here for 25 years. I am here talking to locals and they are interested in an all womens race of another sort as well. Can Feisty put together a zoom so we can talk it out as women? No one on this Island likes the white male dominated Ironman situation. They are not kind to the locals. The women are!
I am so angered by this. I have the original 50 to Kona pin from that movement. Here I thought women were finally being taken seriously then the white male patriarchy says no, women, we don't want you in our sport. I live in LA. Do you know the male to female cyclist ratio? 90/10. Where are the women riding? At home on trainers because these men play chicken on roads throughout LA. Do you know how many times I have had to swerve not to be hit? EVERY RIDE FOR MORE THAN A DECADE. Kelly, this piece is the most important you have written. The white male echo chamber of ironman is real. White male fragility is also real.
“That’s not the job of a CEO, to implement poll results. If that’s all you want to do, then you certainly don’t need to pay an executive. Just hire a junior account manager to send out some SurveyMonkeys and be done with it.”
🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
And just like that my training plans just changed…
Hugely disappointing. Thankfully this type of thinking and logic has me feeling more and more likely to
Not return to ironman ever.
I will never give them my money again. I am headed to Kona for vacation on Saturday as I do every year. I will ride the queen k and swim with the fish for free. Also, i can run as i chose and it will cost zero dollars. Women need to start our own competing triathlong organization. I will give money to the start up. I am still mad about what Ironman did to Beth McKenzie (Gerdes). Thankfully she is living her best life and killing it with WYN. Man I am fired up in LA today!
How do we start our own women run ironman on the island :) I think we could probably make a casual self supported race happen